Forgiving in grace, growing in the Lord

My friend and I both grew up in abusive homes and it's hard not to harbor hard feelings towards our families.  (My friend’s family treats total strangers better than they do her).  We pray for them and do our best "to be angry and sin not."  My friend says that our thoughts alone would prove we aren't saved.  But, I believe that if our Risen Savior saved Saul and made him the Apostle to the Gentiles, then we are saved by what Christ did, never by how we live.  Of course, that doesn't mean we are to stay "babes in Christ" either.

As far as your personal situations with your family, I'm sorry to hear that, and I know that it has hurt and does hurt. As one myself who was abandoned by my father, I know the pain, anguish and lasting anger and resentment it can cause. But that is where the Lord and the Word of His grace comes in. It took and still takes the blessings of the grace message to heal me and it will you, too—all in good time. It is vain to hold anger, and resentment towards those who hurt you because the only one it hurts is you (and those close to you that you love)!

So instead of holding on to the anger, ask God to heal your pain and release you from the anger, and them continue to pray for your family to get saved and come unto a knowledge of the truth! This does not mean you must have a relationship with those that hurt you (at least until they both acknowledge and work at righting those wrongs through an apology and other efforts), but all it means is that you release it to God, knowing that you have sinned more and much greater sins against God, than any human being has towards you!

Ephesians 4:32

And be ye kind one to another, tenderhearted, forgiving one another, even as God for Christ's sake hath forgiven you.

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As for being saved, yes, you are saved eternally by trusting [by faith alone] in Christ's shed blood and not by how you live [by faith plus works—that’s Israel’s program].  But like you said, you are not to stay babes or carnal like our brethren at Corinth, but are to grow and mature spiritually in Christ!

1 Corinthians 3:1-3

And I, brethren, could not speak unto you as unto spiritual, but as unto carnal, even as unto babes in Christ. I have fed you with milk, and not with meat: for hitherto ye were not able to bear it, neither yet now are ye able. For ye are yet carnal: for whereas there is among you envying, and strife, and divisions, are ye not carnal, and walk as men?

Colossians 1:9

For this cause we also, since the day we heard it, do not cease to pray for you, and to desire that ye might be filled with the knowledge of his will in all wisdom and spiritual understanding;

"To be filled with knowledge, wisdom and understanding!"  That is your service; and, it is your service that will be judged by the Lord at the Judgment Seat of Christ!  You can click here to listen to past sermons where I deal with this and other topics.

Hopefully this helps!

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Northern California Grace Fellowship

Do you have a question for Pastor Ron?

 Heir of God or Joint-Heirs with Christ? 

Wrongly Deriding Joint-heirs with Christ

A new body, a glorious body

Does our soul go to heaven when we die, or does it sleep here on earth until the rapture?  I have posed this question to other grace believers and have heard it answered several ways. I’ve also heard that our bodies are changed or that Christ will bring our new bodies with Him. 

One other question, [I forget which verse it is where] Paul states that certain types of people won't be in heaven as we once were.  Les Feldick stated ‘that proves we have to change after becoming believers,’ while Richard Jordan and others state that some people don't always change.  If Les is right, then the young man in 1 Corinthians couldn't have been saved, tho Paul says they were to pray for Satan to kill his body but his soul would be saved.  Paul also says some are saved as if by fire. 


Our soul does not sleep when we die, it goes directly into the presence of the Lord Jesus and, it is conscious!

2 Corinthians 5:1-8

For we know that if our earthly house of this tabernacle were dissolved, we have a building of God, an house not made with hands, eternal in the heavens. For in this we groan, earnestly desiring to be clothed upon with our house which is from heaven:  If so be that being clothed we shall not be found naked.  For we that are in this tabernacle do groan, being burdened: not for that we would be unclothed, but clothed upon, that mortality might be swallowed up of life.  Now he that hath wrought us for the selfsame thing is God, who also hath given unto us the earnest of the Spirit.  Therefore we are always confident, knowing that, whilst we are at home in the body, we are absent from the Lord:  (For we walk by faith, not by sight:)  We are confident, I say, and willing rather to be absent from the body, and to be present with the Lord.

“To be” speaks to our 'state of being.'  The only thing that "sleeps" is our old physical, earthly body because it is dead, and death looks like sleeping.

So while our souls are alive with the Lord after death, we will still one day be given a brand new body of glory at the resurrection/Rapture as you can read in the above verses and in the following verses!

Philippians 3:20-21

For our conversation is in heaven; from whence also we look for the Saviour, the Lord Jesus Christ:  Who shall change our vile body, that it may be fashioned like unto his glorious body, according to the working whereby he is able even to subdue all things unto himself.

Romans 8:23

And not only they, but ourselves also, which have the firstfruits of the Spirit, even we ourselves groan within ourselves, waiting for the adoption, to wit, the redemption of our body.

1 Corinthians 15:51-54

Behold, I shew you a mystery; We shall not all sleep [die a physical death], but we shall all [those believers who have died and those still living] be changed, In a moment, in the twinkling of an eye, at the last trump: for the trumpet shall sound, and the dead shall be raised incorruptible, and we shall be changed.  For this corruptible [decaying bodies] must put on incorruption, and this mortal [living, yet subject to death] must put on immortality.  So when this corruptible shall have put on incorruption, and this mortal shall have put on immortality, then shall be brought to pass the saying that is written, Death is swallowed up in victory.

As you can see, if the rapture happens while we are alive, our current bodies will be changed instantly into our bodies of glory. So Christ will not bring our new bodies with him, he'll just change us into them with His word!

Philippians 3:21

Who shall change our vile body, that it may be fashioned like unto his glorious body, according to the working whereby he is able even to subdue all things unto himself.

The passage in 1 Corinthians 15 lets us know that us members of the Body of Christ will change into our heavenly bodies...that is, spiritual bodies that are able to function and will operate in the heavenlies.  But the people of Israel, and all those in the earthly kingdom, will have bodies a little different, that is, earthly bodies....bodies of glory that operate in the earth!

1 Corinthians 15:40

There are also celestial bodies, and bodies terrestrial: but the glory of the celestial is one, and the glory of the terrestrial is another.

So Les is dealing with the Body of Christ [in the heavenlies/celestial], while Brother Jordan was most likely talking about the Jews in the earthly [terrestrial] kingdom.

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As far as the guy in 1 Corinthians 5, he was a saved person already, so he could not ever lose his salvation. Paul is not talking about salvation as eternal life, he is talking about salvation as far as that man's service for the Lord. Paul wants that person to recover so that he can receive a reward at the judgment seat of Christ! Paul was not allowing Satan to kill him—Paul wanted him to live!  He was allowing Satan to beat up on him, in order for the man to repent and come back! Paul also did not say that his "soul" might be saved because his soul was already saved! Paul says that his "spirit" might be saved because it is with the spirit that we worship and serve God!

Romans 1:9

For God is my witness, whom I serve with my spirit in the gospel of his Son, that without ceasing I make mention of you always in my prayers;

Philippians 3:3

For we are the circumcision, which worship God in the spirit, and rejoice in Christ Jesus, and have no confidence in the flesh.

So Paul did not want Satan to kill the man, but to make his life very tough.  And, the man's soul is not the issue, but his service in the spirit!

1 Corinthians 5:5

To deliver such an one unto Satan for the destruction of the flesh, that the spirit may be saved in the day of the Lord Jesus.

Paul would allow Satan to punish this believer in his flesh (by barring him from fellowship with other saints)—that way life would become so tough on him that he would repent and return to the will of God, which he did!

2 Corinthians 2:6-11

Sufficient to such a man is this punishment, which was inflicted of many.  So that contrariwise ye ought rather to forgive him, and comfort him, lest perhaps such a one should be swallowed up with overmuch sorrow.  Wherefore I beseech you that ye would confirm your love toward him.  For to this end also did I write, that I might know the proof of you, whether ye be obedient in all things.  To whom ye forgive any thing, I forgive also: for if I forgave any thing, to whom I forgave it, for your sakes forgave I it in the person of Christ;  Lest Satan should get an advantage of us: for we are not ignorant of his devices.

The brother in the Lord repented of his evil and Paul told them to let him come back. So, you see, he never lost his salvation in the first place and he recovered himself and now can serve God again and get a full reward at the Judgment Seat of Christ!

Had the guy not repented [turned from his sinning], he would have been one of those who would be saved (go to heaven) yet so as by fire (with no reward).

1 Corinthians 3:15

If any man's work shall be burned, he shall suffer loss: but he himself shall be saved ; yet so as by fire.

So the issue is not soul salvation with the guy but, his works/service in the Lord Jesus!

And as far as brother Les' understanding of the verses, how that based on it a person is either not saved or can lose their salvation, he is wrong! There is nothing that a saved person can do today that will keep them out of heaven! That's God's grace!

Hopefully this helps...

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Northern California Grace Fellowship

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